King of ALL Idiots
Please watch this video, and tell me that I am wrong… Mike looks at NO STATS ever… He is clueless… If a caller calls in and makes a good point he gets yelled down and hung up on. The man knows NOTHING.
His premise that Joba can’t go 5 innings is foolish BTW… the guy has gone 7 innings once, 6 innings three times, pitched into the 6th two more times, pitched into the 5th two times, and only 4 innings last night… so based on last night Mike says he isn’t even a 5 inning pitcher
Watch and enjoy…
The numbers that the caller Alex was trying to tell Francesa about are:
The stat is that since he became a starting pitcher, Joba has one of the lower ERA’s among starting pitchers. Last year, as a starter, Joba had a 2.76 ERA in 65 IP. This year, Chamberlain has a 3.97 ERA in 45 IP.
Overall, as a starter, Joba has a 3.25 ERA, and has averaged 9.8 K/9 IP.
Thanks to Dalepolley from the official Yankee Fan Fourm for posting the stats.
lol
i laugh at his baseball iq. he has this obession, joba can’t be starter, hughes is a starter, but joba somehow just made mlb as a reliever
He seriously has NO CLUE… He has a computer right next to him, yet he never looks at the stats. He uses the NY POST for all his stats. Mike is all about what happened in the last game. He is incapable of looking at the big picture. He is a fool. If he were to leave radio tomorrow, i would throw a parade.
Mike Francesa is such a moron. The best part is the Andy Pettitte can’t pitch the eighth inning rant. What the hell did that have to do with anything, and how does he know Andy couldn’t be a setup man? I actually think he could be, in fact most good starters could probably be effective late-inning relievers. Closers? No. Setup men? Yes.
All Joba-to-the-pen people aren’t like this either. I think he is a starter, but there are valid points on the other side of the argument too, Francesa just never seems to make them.
I couldn’t believe how crazy he got. I think he might be retarded. He always refuses to listen to the callers. As much as I hated Mad Dog for his views, he kept Mike in line. I seriously felt like he was about to have a heart attack when he was shaking the mic. What a joke.
Sorry , he is right. Joba’s era and whip are awful. He can’t get out of the 5th inning most of the time . He wastes too many pitches, Has too many 3-2 counts and can’t finish off the batters.
Joba= heir to Mariano plain and simple
His WHIP does need to come down… That is true… But if he is putting too many people on base, why would you want him to pitch in a close game where if he puts someone on base the game could be blown? You can’t argue a reason why he shouldn’t start, when as a set up guy or closer the high WHIP would do more damage.
His ERA as a starter (career) is 3.25, that’s too high? Seriously? He has a 3.97 now, a bit higher than I would like but for a 23 year old in the AL… It is just fine… who other than CC is lower on the Yankees?
He is 23. He is still developing. The Yankees are in first place with him as a starter. He has posted the 2nd best numbers of our starting staff.
He is a starter.
Like I told u last nite Ruhi, I think it helps the Yankees alot more with Joba in the Pen. 1.5 plus runners on base per inning for a starter is a disaster in the making. I am not taking anything away from Joba but, for the team I feel Joba would help their pen more than b’ing a starter.
the professor
LOL I know u know who this is
see the comment above yours regarding WHIP…
I think for the short term Joba would help the pen, But a guy with his stuff.. “++” fastball, “++” slider, “+” curve, “+” change you don’t waste him in the pen. Should Price be in the pen for the Rays, who only wish they had a guy like Mo sitting in the pen?
Starters are more valuable to a team over the course of a season then a setup man.
Since you are a Mets fan tell me… do you think a guy with these numbers should be in the pen? 4.31 ERA, 1.46 WHIP, .283 BAA 6 IP/start avg (career 4.31, 1.47, .283)… That would be Mike Pelfrey…
Joba is pretty close, with less experience, which he is getting now…
3.97 ERA, 1.57 WHIP, .275 BAA 5.2 IP/start avg. (career 2.65, 1.27, .233)
So being they are so close, should Pelf be in the pen for the Mets? My answer would of course be NO… but Pelf is the Mets number 2 with similar numbers to the Yankees number 5…
Obviously u still have alot to learn Ruhi !! You see the difference is the Yanks have enough to put him in the pen and that’s where he started. The Mets don’t have that option and Big pelf. Hasn’t been in the pen. Heilman was in the pen after bing a starter in a situation as is Joba right now. Your crap with this ++ or + stuff is off balance here. If he was ++ in every category then why is he avg’ing 1.5+ runners per innning ? obviously It’s not plus plus anything. Joba is a strong pitcher and I will bet u anything pelf has better numbers as a starter than joba this year. put your money where your mouth is. I always do.
the Professor
He has “++” stuff… that doesn’t mean he has full command of it yet, hence the high walk total. The guy has a 9.8 K’s/9 K ratio… that comes from having ++ stuff.
No the Mets don’t need Pelf in the pen… that wasn’t the point. The Yankees could insert Hughes in the rotation and move Joba to the pen, but in my opinion that weakens the team. Joba’s numbers as a starter are much better than Hughes. You do not waste Joba in the pen for this season… it will stunt further development. He is already on an innings limit. He will get to 150-160 and next year be able to pitch 180-200… Then it’s off to the races with all pitching limits done.
Pettitte will be gone next year. The rotation will be CC, AJ, Wang, Joba, Hughes… Yankee haters always say the Yankees buy everything… and when they want to develop a possible ACE starter people want him in the pen… There is no winning in NY.
I would be willing to bet Joba has a better ERA than Pelf… I won’t bet wins and losses because that is a team stat… But I will bet Joba has a better ERA… $20?
You r the first one to say he is good enough to stay where he is but the first to say he has to go to the pen come post season if they make it. I just think you don’t get the big picture here. I feel hughes can b a better starter than Joba and that’s my opinion. I feel the pen is the yanx weakness and with the aging Mo they will b in trouble in the end bc they don’t have another arm like his in the pen. What happens when Wang comes back with the way hughes is pitching ?
The only reason I told you he should be in the pen in the post season is because he will have hit his innings limit… It has nothing to do with more than that. Teams carry 4 starters in the PS… so you use your 5th in the pen. It’s that simple…
Let Hughes show he can be a better starter… Joba has a sub 4 ERA… Hughes is sub 7. The way Hughes is pitching? LOL its ONE start. Look at the numbers, don’t be like fat Mike Rob… you know more than he does.
I said better numbersperiod. ERA come on.. another way to try to scoot by. I believe pelf will have a lower era for sure but I want the whole thing or nothing. Pelf will have a better era, whip, wins so on. r u in ? Back your boys if u have the stones ?? LOL
No deal… Wins is a bad stat that people who don’t understand how to look at stats use.
ERA is how you determine how good the guy is… It shows how many runs/9 innings a guy gives up… Wins takes an offense to actually do something.
What about K’s wanna bet that? Somehow I doubt it.
So bet the ERA… you are so sure Pelf is better he should give up less runs per 9 right? If he is better that would be the case.
I’ll tell you what Professor… next time I stop by your house we can discuss parameters of a bet we can both agree to based on a smattering of stats… We can discuss the parameters over a bowl of greens.
It is funny how u are going nuts with Joba but u won’t back him. WHIP scares the shit out of u in that bet huh ?? LOL I will give u a perfect example here. Red sox needed pen help and they had a kid STARTER that had ++ stuff also. His name is Johnathan Papelbon and he is one of the best closers in the game. Without Papelbon their pen was bad. the team needed him and he answered the bell. U have to have a full team. You seem to think your pen is great. Without MO the pen is awful and come time in must situations I wouldn’t count on them. Sweeney Murti was even saying yesterday how he thinks the Yanks are better with him in the pen. I won’t bet on era alone bc its gay. U r trying to get a bet with me on 1 category. WHIP is probably the most important stat bc it tells us how much they r out of the stretch, how many guys r on each inning and that’s what puts a toll on the staff in the pen. I will say u r scared of the bet bc u know deep down u have no idea what will become of Joba at this point. it’s ok I have enough of ur money anyway.. LOL His velocity was down the other night as well. it may be bc his knee is sore I dont know. Varitek just hit a ball in the upper tank in Minnesota. It was a BOMB…
see the post above yours…
Professor,
Comparing him to Papelbon is just wrong. Papelbon was never projected as a front end of the rotation starter. He had two plus pitches and in the rare scenario that he works more then one inning, you see a significant drop in velocity from Papelbon. Joba has always had a higher ceiling then Papelbon. And not dismissing Joba’s health concerns, but Papelbons shoulder has given out on him at least two times that I can remember. These were the reasons Boston kept him in the bullpen.
Second, taking Joba and converting him into a reliever hurts the Yankees more than it helps. Say you move Joba to the bullpen. The Yankees now have a rotation of Sabathia, Pettitte, Burnett, Hughes, and Wang. What happens if Burnett or Hughes get hurt (or in Hughes’ case, pitches bad)? What happens if Wang continues to pitch bad? Pettitte is no spring chicken either. We saw what happened with him in the second half of last year when his shoulder gave out. Who do the Yankees turn to? Well they could take Aceves out of the middle reliver/long man role but that takes a quality arm out of the pen. Furthermore, I think Aceves is great for the bullpen since he only has to face a lineup once (usually). So whose left? Kennedy is done for the year. That leaves the Yankees with Jason Johnson, Josh Towers, Casey Fossum, or Kei Igawa. Sorry if I am not on board for that.
Relievers are a dime a dozen and the Yankees can easily grab a reliever at the deadline from a team out of contention. Colorado, Arizona, Houston, Pittsburgh, Washington, Florida, Oakland, Seattle, Cleveland, and the White Sox are all looking like sellers at this point.
It really blows my mind whenever this discussion comes up. Joba is the only person this bullpen argument applies to. Why don’t the Red Sox move Buccholz to the bullpen? Why don’t the Mariners move King Felix? Why is Joba the only young pitcher with high upside that belongs in the bullpen? And lets go back in time since you’re dodging putting Pelfrey in the bullpen: why didn’t the Mets put Pelfrey in the bullpen last year when they were so desperate for a quality relief arm that they had Luis Ayala closing games?
Joba to the pen is like putting a band aid on a gun shot wound. You stop the bleeding in one area but you still have a huge problem.
P.S.: The Yankees are 27-20 with that horrible bullpen and tied for first place (for at least another three outs since Boston is winning 3-1 in the bottom of the ninth). Whats the panic anyway?
Papelbon is a reliever because he wanted to be a reliever. He specifically asked the Red Sox front office to be a closer. He has one plus plus pitch (his fastball). That is basically the only pitch he can throw as a reliever. You are comparing him to Joba, who has 4 above average pitches. That is really the reason why Joba is not a reliever.
Just so u know, they tried Papelbon out as a starter before putting him in the bullpen. He struggled after they gave him a shot in the rotation. At least let Joba struggle for a year before you declare him to be a reliever. It is also important to note that the season is only 1/4 of the way through, and it is likely the Yankees will make him a reliever should we get into the playoffs.
“bet u anything pelf has better numbers as a starter than joba this year.”
i doubt it, joba a superior pitcher. joba has a 3.97 era and hasn’t pitched well, which btw has a much lower era in the nl. you talk about joba whip, is really bad, wanna talk about mike 1.46 whip
All I know is that the people from NoMaas are just idiots. They have no clue about baseball. They’re just dumb. Joba should be in the bull pen. He never makes it past the fifth inning because he tries to strike every one out and he throws too many pitches in the process. Not only that, he only throws 89-91 on his fastball as a starter.
Count me in as an idiot… I happen to believe the same thing,.. Have you looked at the site you are posting on? LOL
Good thing Cashman came out today and said Joba is a starter…
Read here… http://ruhikuz.wordpress.com/2009/05/29/starter/
There is a link at the bottom of my post with an article from Newsday. Enjoy the read.
sean just stop your posts is bunch of bs
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